Re: [HACKERS] Anyone want to assist with the

Hi everyone,

Have just put together a prototype page to show off the multi-lingual
capabilities that the Advocacy sites' infrastructure has:

http://advocacy.postgresql.org/?lang=de

The text was translated to german via Altavista's Babelfish, so it's
probably only about 80% accurate, but it conveys the concept.

Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
languages? All Latin based languages should be fine (German, French,
Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Turkish, Greek, etc).

If there's strong interest, then an interface to let volunteers
translators do it easily can be constructed over the next fortnight or
so.

:-)

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Justin Clift <justin(at)postgresql(dot)org> wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Have just put together a prototype page to show off the multi-lingual
> capabilities that the Advocacy sites' infrastructure has:
>
> http://advocacy.postgresql.org/?lang=de
>
> The text was translated to german via Altavista's Babelfish, so it's
> probably only about 80% accurate, but it conveys the concept.
>
> Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
> languages? All Latin based languages should be fine (German, French,
> Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Turkish, Greek, etc).
>
> If there's strong interest, then an interface to let volunteers
> translators do it easily can be constructed over the next fortnight or
> so.

Hi Justin,

I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead an
interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.

Best Regards,
Michael Paesold

Hi Michael,

Michael Paesold wrote:
<snip>
> Hi Justin,
>
> I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
> translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
> translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead an
> interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.

Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
translation into a second column?

That might be easiest, and will allow a cut-n-paste of the German
version straight into the database backend.

Sound workable to you?

:-)

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> Best Regards,
> Michael Paesold

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Justin Clift <justin(at)postgresql(dot)org> wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>
> Michael Paesold wrote:
> <snip>
> > Hi Justin,
> >
> > I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
> > translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
> > translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead
an
> > interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.
>
> Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> translation into a second column?
>
> That might be easiest, and will allow a cut-n-paste of the German
> version straight into the database backend.
>
> Sound workable to you?

Spreadsheet sounds great. I use M$.
Perhaps you can group the items in categories, at least navigation and text.
So I know where the text will be put on the website. The translation could
be different depending on how a word is used. E.g. it is quite common on
German websites to use the same English word "Home" for the main page; but
you would not use "Home" in a different context. The exceptable length of a
translation depends on the context, too.

Best Regards,
Michael Paesold

The lock on the relation owning the rule wasn't unlocked.

On Wed, 2002-10-02 at 19:36, Michael Paesold wrote:
> Justin Clift <justin(at)postgresql(dot)org> wrote:
>
>
> > Hi Michael,
> >
> > Michael Paesold wrote:
> > <snip>
> > > Hi Justin,
> > >
> > > I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
> > > translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
> > > translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead
> an
> > > interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.
> >
> > Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> > the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> > translation into a second column?
> >
> > That might be easiest, and will allow a cut-n-paste of the German
> > version straight into the database backend.
> >
> > Sound workable to you?
>
> Spreadsheet sounds great. I use M$.
> Perhaps you can group the items in categories, at least navigation and text.
> So I know where the text will be put on the website. The translation could
> be different depending on how a word is used. E.g. it is quite common on
> German websites to use the same English word "Home" for the main page; but
> you would not use "Home" in a different context. The exceptable length of a
> translation depends on the context, too.
>
> Best Regards,
> Michael Paesold
>
>
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 5: Have you checked our extensive FAQ?
>
> http://www.postgresql.org/users-lounge/docs/faq.html
>
--
Rod Taylor

Justin wrote:
> Hi Michael,
> Michael Paesold wrote:
> <snip>
> > Hi Justin,
> > I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
> > translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
> > translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead an
> > interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.
>
> Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> translation into a second column?

Isn't this, um, the sort of thing you might want to put into, um, a, um,
database?
--
(concatenate 'string "aa454" "@freenet.carleton.ca")
http://cbbrowne.com/info/internet.html
"you can obvioulsy understand what i'm saying. you're just being
pendantic." -- bazzz777(at)yahoo(dot)com

cbbrowne(at)cbbrowne(dot)com wrote:
<snip>
> > Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> > the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> > translation into a second column?
>
> Isn't this, um, the sort of thing you might want to put into, um, a, um,
> database?

Sure is. Are there any good options apart from?

a) Build an interface for people to translate through
b) Allow selected people to connect directly to the database

For the present b) is not an option as I don't have the needed access to
the postgresql.org database server to be able to adjust the pg_hba.conf
file, and a) Would take some decent time and effort to get up and
running. A lot longer than cut and pasting into an Excel document then
back out again. :-/

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> --
> (concatenate 'string "aa454" "@freenet.carleton.ca")
> http://cbbrowne.com/info/internet.html
> "you can obvioulsy understand what i'm saying. you're just being
> pendantic." -- bazzz777(at)yahoo(dot)com

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Rod Taylor <rbt(at)rbt(dot)ca> writes:
> /* Call CreateComments() to create/drop the comments */
> CreateComments(ruleoid, classoid, 0, comment);
> +
> + heap_close(relation, AccessShareLock);
> }
>
> /*

Ooops.

I think though that this should read

+ heap_close(relation, NoLock);

In general, we hold locks on user relations we are modifying until end
of transaction. This is different from the rule for system catalogs
(eg, it's okay to drop the AccessShareLock on pg_rewrite a few lines
above this). The reason for the distinction is that we want to be
sure that the user relation won't get DROPped by someone else before
we've committed our changes. (If someone else did try to drop it in
that interval, they'd not delete the pg_description row we just added,
because they couldn't see it.) On the other hand, system catalogs such
as pg_rewrite are not going to go away, by definition, and so it's okay
to drop their locks early. The only reason we lock system catalogs at
all is to allow VACUUM FULL to nail down exclusive access to a catalog
while it vacuums it.

regards, tom lane

> Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> translation into a second column?
>
> That might be easiest, and will allow a cut-n-paste of the German
> version straight into the database backend.

Hi Justin,

I would gladly do the translation in French. I don't have too much time
being both a freelancer and a young daddy, but there isn't that much content
so I should be able to manage.

I don't have OpenOffice, so an Excel worksheet would do fine.

Cheers.

--------
François

Home page: http://www.monpetitcoin.com/
"A fox is a wolf who sends flowers"

>
>
>Hi everyone,
>
>Have just put together a prototype page to show off the multi-lingual
>capabilities that the Advocacy sites' infrastructure has:
>
>http://advocacy.postgresql.org/?lang=de
>
>The text was translated to german via Altavista's Babelfish, so it's
>probably only about 80% accurate, but it conveys the concept.
>
>Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
>languages? All Latin based languages should be fine (German, French,
>Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Turkish, Greek, etc).
>
>If there's strong interest, then an interface to let volunteers
>translators do it easily can be constructed over the next fortnight or
>so.
>
>:-)
>
>Regards and best wishes,
>
>Justin Clift
>
>
>
Justin,

I would be glad to translate it to brazilian portuguese.
Here we have a lot of companies starting to use PostgreSQL, including
the one where I work and some of our clients.
It would be very nice to have this site translated.

Cheers,

--
Diogo de Oliveira Biazus
diogo(at)ikono(dot)com(dot)br
Ikono Sistemas e Automação
http://www.ikono.com.br

> Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
> languages?

I don't have time for the translation, unfortunately, but i would
suggest changing "worlds" to "world's" on the main page.

-tfo

Thomas O'Connell wrote:
>
> > Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
> > languages?
>
> I don't have time for the translation, unfortunately, but i would
> suggest changing "worlds" to "world's" on the main page.

Um, doesn't "world's" mean "world is" ?

That wouldn't make sense then though. ?

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> -tfo
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 1: subscribe and unsubscribe commands go to majordomo(at)postgresql(dot)org

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

> Um, doesn't "world's" mean "world is" ?

In this situation, the "'s" denotes possession, as in "the most advanced
open source database of the world".

"worlds" here is basically saying "every world most advanced open source
database" and does not, in any case, connote possession.

-tfo

"Thomas F.O'Connell" wrote:
>
> > Um, doesn't "world's" mean "world is" ?
>
> In this situation, the "'s" denotes possession, as in "the most advanced
> open source database of the world".
>
> "worlds" here is basically saying "every world most advanced open source
> database" and does not, in any case, connote possession.

Ok, updating it now. Thanks heaps Thomas.

:-)

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> -tfo

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

> Um, doesn't "world's" mean "world is" ?

i forgot to provide a real-world example:

http://www.amazon.com/

"Earth's Biggest Selection"

-tfo

Hi Justin,

you want probably use the language-negotiation
rather then a query variable :-)

Regards
Tino

--On Donnerstag, 3. Oktober 2002 08:53 +1000 Justin Clift
<justin(at)postgresql(dot)org> wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> Have just put together a prototype page to show off the multi-lingual
> capabilities that the Advocacy sites' infrastructure has:
>
> http://advocacy.postgresql.org/?lang=de
>
> The text was translated to german via Altavista's Babelfish, so it's
> probably only about 80% accurate, but it conveys the concept.
>
> Is anyone interested in translating the English version to other
> languages? All Latin based languages should be fine (German, French,
> Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Turkish, Greek, etc).
>
> If there's strong interest, then an interface to let volunteers
> translators do it easily can be constructed over the next fortnight or
> so.
>
> :-)
>
> Regards and best wishes,
>
> Justin Clift
>
> --
> "My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
> who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
> first group; there was less competition there."
> - Indira Gandhi
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 4: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster

Hi Tino,

Tino Wildenhain wrote:
>
> Hi Justin,
>
> you want probably use the language-negotiation
> rather then a query variable :-)

Um, language-negotiation in good in theory, but there are real world
scenarios it doesn't take into account. :(

However, the query variable is an override, and if one isn't present
then the backend is supposed to use other means to determine the
appropriate language, including the browsers preferred language. It's
just that the code to do this bit hasn't been written yet. :-)

If all else fails it falls back to a default language, English for this
site.

:-)

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> Regards
> Tino
<snip>

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Hi Justin,

--On Donnerstag, 3. Oktober 2002 09:23 +1000 Justin Clift
<justin(at)postgresql(dot)org> wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>
> Michael Paesold wrote:
> <snip>
>> Hi Justin,
>>
>> I am from Austria, and I would like to help. I could provide a German
>> translation. The Babelfish's translation is really funny. Machine
>> translation is readable, but it is no advocacy. ;-) I do not really nead
>> an interface, but just tell me in what way you want the texts.
>
> Cool. Could you deal with an OpenOffice Calc or M$ Excel file having
> the lines of English text in one column, and doing the German
> translation into a second column?

> That might be easiest, and will allow a cut-n-paste of the German
> version straight into the database backend.

Haha cut&paste ;-) Ever heard of csv? :-))

However, I can also have a look at it, if desired.

Regards
Tino

> Sound workable to you?
>
> :-)
>
> Regards and best wishes,
>
> Justin Clift
>
>> Best Regards,
>> Michael Paesold
>
> --
> "My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
> who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
> first group; there was less competition there."
> - Indira Gandhi
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 2: you can get off all lists at once with the unregister command
> (send "unregister YourEmailAddressHere" to majordomo(at)postgresql(dot)org)

Tino Wildenhain wrote:
<snip>
> Haha cut&paste ;-) Ever heard of csv? :-))
>
> However, I can also have a look at it, if desired.

Heh Heh Heh

Good point. For the moment we've whipped up that MS Excel document
(created in OpenOffice of course) of all the English text strings in the
site and emailed it to the volunteers. :)

So far community members have volunteered for German, Turkish, French,
Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese, and Polish.

Cool. :)

Want to co-ordinate with the other two German language volunteers?

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

> Regards
> Tino

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Hi Justin,

> Good point. For the moment we've whipped up that MS Excel document
> (created in OpenOffice of course) of all the English text strings in the
> site and emailed it to the volunteers. :)

Btw. did you ever unzip the native OpenOffice (aka StarOffice)
file?

>
> So far community members have volunteered for German, Turkish, French,
> Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese, and Polish.
>
> Cool. :)
>
> Want to co-ordinate with the other two German language volunteers?

Sure. So I'm here :-)

Regards
Tino

Tino Wildenhain <tino(at)wildenhain(dot)de> wrote:

> Hi Justin,
>
> > Good point. For the moment we've whipped up that MS Excel document
> > (created in OpenOffice of course) of all the English text strings in the
> > site and emailed it to the volunteers. :)
>
> Btw. did you ever unzip the native OpenOffice (aka StarOffice)
> file?
>
> >
> > So far community members have volunteered for German, Turkish, French,
> > Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese, and Polish.
> >
> > Cool. :)
> >
> > Want to co-ordinate with the other two German language volunteers?
>
> Sure. So I'm here :-)
>
> Regards
> Tino

You should have already got at least two mails, haven't you?

Michael

Hi Michael,

yeah, I got :-)

I'm busy reviewing :-)

Regards
Tino

--On Donnerstag, 3. Oktober 2002 21:54 +0200 Michael Paesold
<mpaesold(at)gmx(dot)at> wrote:

> Tino Wildenhain <tino(at)wildenhain(dot)de> wrote:
>
>> Hi Justin,
>>
>> > Good point. For the moment we've whipped up that MS Excel document
>> > (created in OpenOffice of course) of all the English text strings in
>> > the site and emailed it to the volunteers. :)
>>
>> Btw. did you ever unzip the native OpenOffice (aka StarOffice)
>> file?
>>
>> >
>> > So far community members have volunteered for German, Turkish, French,
>> > Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese, and Polish.
>> >
>> > Cool. :)
>> >
>> > Want to co-ordinate with the other two German language volunteers?
>>
>> Sure. So I'm here :-)
>>
>> Regards
>> Tino
>
> You should have already got at least two mails, haven't you?
>
> Michael
>

Tom's change added to Rod's patch:

Your patch has been added to the PostgreSQL unapplied patches list at:

http://candle.pha.pa.us/cgi-bin/pgpatches

I will try to apply it within the next 48 hours.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tom Lane wrote:
> Rod Taylor <rbt(at)rbt(dot)ca> writes:
> > /* Call CreateComments() to create/drop the comments */
> > CreateComments(ruleoid, classoid, 0, comment);
> > +
> > + heap_close(relation, AccessShareLock);
> > }
> >
> > /*
>
> Ooops.
>
> I think though that this should read
>
> + heap_close(relation, NoLock);
>
> In general, we hold locks on user relations we are modifying until end
> of transaction. This is different from the rule for system catalogs
> (eg, it's okay to drop the AccessShareLock on pg_rewrite a few lines
> above this). The reason for the distinction is that we want to be
> sure that the user relation won't get DROPped by someone else before
> we've committed our changes. (If someone else did try to drop it in
> that interval, they'd not delete the pg_description row we just added,
> because they couldn't see it.) On the other hand, system catalogs such
> as pg_rewrite are not going to go away, by definition, and so it's okay
> to drop their locks early. The only reason we lock system catalogs at
> all is to allow VACUUM FULL to nail down exclusive access to a catalog
> while it vacuums it.
>
> regards, tom lane
>
> ---------------------------(end of broadcast)---------------------------
> TIP 1: subscribe and unsubscribe commands go to majordomo(at)postgresql(dot)org
>

--
Bruce Momjian | http://candle.pha.pa.us
pgman(at)candle(dot)pha(dot)pa(dot)us | (610) 359-1001
+ If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road
+ Christ can be your backup. | Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073

Hi Adrian,

Wow. That's pretty cool. :)

No-one has offered to do Romanian yet, so you're very welcome to.

First things first:

- What is the two letter language identifier most often used for
Romanian? i.e. fr = Franch, de = German, etc. ro?
- What is the character set that should be used to send out Romanian
pages? i.e. for English, French, German it's iso-8859-1, for Turkish
it's iso-8859-9, Romanian = ?

:-)

Regards and best wishes,

Justin Clift

am(at)fx(dot)ro wrote:
>
> Hello !
>
> I'd like to translate the advocacy site to Romanian,
> as long as nobody else has already offered himself/herself
> to do it.
>
> Just tell me, please, what should i do.
>
> Adrian Maier
> (am(at)fx(dot)ro)

--
"My grandfather once told me that there are two kinds of people: those
who work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the
first group; there was less competition there."
- Indira Gandhi

Hello !

I'd like to translate the advocacy site to Romanian,
as long as nobody else has already offered himself/herself
to do it.

Just tell me, please, what should i do.

Adrian Maier
(am(at)fx(dot)ro)

On Tue, Oct 15, 2002 at 05:07:46AM +1000, Justin Clift wrote:
> Hi Adrian,
>
> Wow. That's pretty cool. :)
>
> No-one has offered to do Romanian yet, so you're very welcome to.
>
> First things first:
>
> - What is the two letter language identifier most often used for
> Romanian? i.e. fr = Franch, de = German, etc. ro?

ro = Romanian

> - What is the character set that should be used to send out Romanian
> pages? i.e. for English, French, German it's iso-8859-1, for Turkish
> it's iso-8859-9, Romanian = ?

iso-8859-2