Re: Italian translations being dropped for 15

Hi,

I noticed that Italian translations for core are being dropped for 15
at this point in time. As it stands, it has reached 78%, just short
of the 80% requirement. As it's so close, is someone available to get
this completed?

Thanks

Thom

<div dir='auto'><div>Hi, I'm interested.</div><div dir="auto">Where can I get core translations?<br><div dir="auto"><br><div class="elided-text">Il 7 set 2022 17:39, Thom Brown &lt;thom(at)linux(dot)com&gt; ha scritto:<br type="attribution"><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir="ltr">Hi,
<br>

<br>
I noticed that Italian translations for core are being dropped for 15
<br>
at this point in time.&nbsp; As it stands, it has reached 78%, just short
<br>
of the 80% requirement.&nbsp; As it's so close, is someone available to get
<br>
this completed?
<br>

<br>
Thanks
<br>

<br>
Thom
<br>

<br>

<br>
</p>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>

On Wed, 7 Sept 2022 at 18:18, Domenico Sgarbossa <sbraaaa(at)yahoo(dot)it> wrote:
>
> Hi, I'm interested.
> Where can I get core translations?

Great. Details can be found on the wiki: https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/NLS

I'm pretty sure that no one else is working on it, but just in case,
I've cc'd Daniele Varazzo who worked on it previously.

Thom

<div dir='auto'><div dir="auto">Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.</div><div dir="auto">I guess I should notice Jonathan.</div><div dir="auto">Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...</div><div><br><div class="elided-text">Il 7 set 2022 19:35, Thom Brown &lt;thom(at)linux(dot)com&gt; ha scritto:<br type="attribution"><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir="ltr">On Wed, 7 Sept 2022 at 18:18, Domenico Sgarbossa &lt;sbraaaa(at)yahoo(dot)it&gt; wrote:
<br>
&gt;
<br>
&gt; Hi, I'm interested.
<br>
&gt; Where can I get core translations?
<br>

<br>
Great.&nbsp; Details can be found on the wiki: https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/NLS
<br>

<br>
I'm pretty sure that no one else is working on it, but just in case,
<br>
I've cc'd Daniele Varazzo who worked on it previously.
<br>

<br>
Thom
<br>
</p>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div>

On 07.09.22 21:13, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.
> I guess I should notice Jonathan.
> Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...

We would usually be cleaning stale translations when the first release
candidate is prepared, which is probably in a few weeks.

On 2022-Sep-08, Peter Eisentraut wrote:

> On 07.09.22 21:13, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> > Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.
> > I guess I should notice Jonathan.
> > Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...
>
> We would usually be cleaning stale translations when the first release
> candidate is prepared, which is probably in a few weeks.

The first release candidate is going to be tagged tomorrow, so if you
have *anything*, it's worth publishing it now. If not, you still have
time until the final release in a couple of weeks.

--
Álvaro Herrera 48°01'N 7°57'E — https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
Are you not unsure you want to delete Firefox?
[Not unsure] [Not not unsure] [Cancel]
http://smylers.hates-software.com/2008/01/03/566e45b2.html

hmmm there's something I don't understand!
I download release 15 beta 4 from https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and ALL the italian PO files are ok.
So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the right place.
could you tell me where can I find the missing translations?
Thanks

Il domenica 25 settembre 2022 21:44:25 CEST, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> ha scritto:

On 2022-Sep-08, Peter Eisentraut wrote:

> On 07.09.22 21:13, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> > Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.
> > I guess I should notice Jonathan.
> > Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...
>
> We would usually be cleaning stale translations when the first release
> candidate is prepared, which is probably in a few weeks.

The first release candidate is going to be tagged tomorrow, so if you
have *anything*, it's worth publishing it now.  If not, you still have
time until the final release in a couple of weeks.

--
Álvaro Herrera              48°01'N 7°57'E  —  https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
Are you not unsure you want to delete Firefox?
      [Not unsure]    [Not not unsure]    [Cancel]
                  http://smylers.hates-software.com/2008/01/03/566e45b2.html

>hmmm there's something I don't understand!
>I download release 15 beta 4 from https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and ALL the italian PO files are ok.
>So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the right place.
>could you tell me where can I find the missing translations?
AFAIK only translated string get into the sources, so yes, you won't
notice the missing ones.

To download the .pot files for work you should use
https://babel.postgresql.org/

Kind Regards

>
>Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Il domenica 25 settembre 2022 21:44:25 CEST, Alvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> ha scritto:
>
>
>
>
>On 2022-Sep-08, Peter Eisentraut wrote:
>
>>On 07.09.22 21:13, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
>> > Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.
>> > I guess I should notice Jonathan.
>> > Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...
>>
>>We would usually be cleaning stale translations when the first release
>>candidate is prepared, which is probably in a few weeks.
>
>The first release candidate is going to be tagged tomorrow, so if you
>have *anything*, it's worth publishing it now. If not, you still have
>time until the final release in a couple of weeks.
>
>-- Álvaro Herrera 48°01'N 7°57'E — https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
>Are you not unsure you want to delete Firefox?
> [Not unsure] [Not not unsure] [Cancel]
> http://smylers.hates-software.com/2008/01/03/566e45b2.html
>
>

Am 26.09.22 um 10:04 schrieb Pavlo Golub:
>
>> hmmm there's something I don't understand!
>> I download release 15 beta 4 from
>> https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and
>> ALL the italian PO files are ok.
>> So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the
>> right place.
>> could you tell me where can I find the missing translations?
> AFAIK only translated string get into the sources, so yes, you won't
> notice the missing ones.
>
> To download the .pot files for work you should use
> https://babel.postgresql.org/
>
> Kind Regards
>
>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Il domenica 25 settembre 2022 21:44:25 CEST, Alvaro Herrera
>> <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> ha scritto:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2022-Sep-08, Peter Eisentraut wrote:
>>
>>> On 07.09.22 21:13, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
>>> > Ok, so if Daniele is agree I will proceed.
>>> > I guess I should notice Jonathan.
>>> > Just one thing: I cannot understand which is the due date ...
>>>
>>> We would usually be cleaning stale translations when the first release
>>> candidate is prepared, which is probably in a few weeks.
>>
>> The first release candidate is going to be tagged tomorrow, so if you
>> have *anything*, it's worth publishing it now.  If not, you still have
>> time until the final release in a couple of weeks.
>>
>> -- Álvaro Herrera              48°01'N 7°57'E  —
>> https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
>> Are you not unsure you want to delete Firefox?
>>       [Not unsure]    [Not not unsure]    [Cancel] Tr
>> http://smylers.hates-software.com/2008/01/03/566e45b2.html
>>
>>
>
>
Try

postgresql-15beta4/src/backend/po$ grep -c msgstr *.po|sort -t: -k2n

and you will see how many strings of the backend have been translated to
the languages. Ideally, all numbers would be identical, so 100% of
strings would have been translated.

Of course there are more directories containing message catalog files.

 /backend/po
 /interfaces/ecpg/ecpglib/po
 /interfaces/ecpg/preproc/po
 /interfaces/libpq/po
 /pl/plperl/po
 /pl/plpgsql/src/po
 /pl/plpython/po
 /pl/tcl/po

Kind Regards,

Holger

--
Holger Jakobs, Bergisch Gladbach, Tel. +49-178-9759012

On 26.09.22 09:45, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> hmmm there's something I don't understand!
> I download release 15 beta 4 from https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and ALL the italian PO files are ok.
> So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the right place.

We drop incomplete translations at RC time, which I just did, so if you
look again at the REL_15_STABLE HEAD, you will see some are gone now.

<div dir='auto'>I found out correct files in&nbsp;https://babel.postgresql.org/<div dir="auto"><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">Il 26 set 2022 13:35, Peter Eisentraut &lt;peter(dot)eisentraut(at)enterprisedb(dot)com&gt; ha scritto:<br type="attribution" /><blockquote class="quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir="ltr">On 26.09.22 09:45, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:&#13;<br>
&gt; hmmm there's something I don't understand!&#13;<br>
&gt; I download release 15 beta 4 from&#160;https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and ALL the italian PO files are ok.&#13;<br>
&gt; So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the right place.&#13;<br>
&#13;<br>
We drop incomplete translations at RC time, which I just did, so if you &#13;<br>
look again at the REL_15_STABLE HEAD, you will see some are gone now.&#13;<br>
&#13;<br>
</p>
</blockquote></div><br></div>

On Mon, 26 Sept 2022 at 12:35, Peter Eisentraut
<peter(dot)eisentraut(at)enterprisedb(dot)com> wrote:
>
> On 26.09.22 09:45, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> > hmmm there's something I don't understand!
> > I download release 15 beta 4 from https://github.com/postgres/postgres/releases/tag/REL_15_BETA4 and ALL the italian PO files are ok.
> > So it seems there's nothing to do... probably I'm not looking at the right place.
>
> We drop incomplete translations at RC time, which I just did, so if you
> look again at the REL_15_STABLE HEAD, you will see some are gone now.

Does this mean it's now too late to get those dropped translations
reinstated prior to final release? Or does this only give an
indication of what will happen if it remains this way?

On Thu, Sep 29, 2022, at 2:56 PM, Thom Brown wrote:
> now.
>
> Does this mean it's now too late to get those dropped translations
> reinstated prior to final release? Or does this only give an
> indication of what will happen if it remains this way?

You can still contribute translations, and need only get past the 80% for each file in order to get it included. What is certain is that if nobody does anything, then it won't be included. Due date is Sunday the 9th.

On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 14:56, Álvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2022, at 2:56 PM, Thom Brown wrote:
>
> now.
>
> Does this mean it's now too late to get those dropped translations
> reinstated prior to final release? Or does this only give an
> indication of what will happen if it remains this way?
>
>
> You can still contribute translations, and need only get past the 80% for each file in order to get it included. What is certain is that if nobody does anything, then it won't be included. Due date is Sunday the 9th.

Domenico, will you be able to get the Italian translations completed
and submitted prior to that date?

--
Thom

On 2022-Sep-29, Thom Brown wrote:

> Domenico, will you be able to get the Italian translations completed
> and submitted prior to that date?

Note that "completed" means 80% of the total, minimum. Taking the
server message catalog ("postgres") as a reference, that's currently at
78% for Italian, so you only need to add about 114 extra translations to
it so that it is included. It is not a *huge* effort. Of course,
getting it to 100% is much better. The other catalogs are much smaller;
the only worrisome one is pg_dump because it's only 25% done, so you'd
need to work a lot to get it yellow in the table.

--
Álvaro Herrera Breisgau, Deutschland — https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
"Nadie está tan esclavizado como el que se cree libre no siéndolo" (Goethe)

On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 16:29, Álvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> wrote:
>
> On 2022-Sep-29, Thom Brown wrote:
>
> > Domenico, will you be able to get the Italian translations completed
> > and submitted prior to that date?
>
> Note that "completed" means 80% of the total, minimum. Taking the
> server message catalog ("postgres") as a reference, that's currently at
> 78% for Italian, so you only need to add about 114 extra translations to
> it so that it is included. It is not a *huge* effort. Of course,
> getting it to 100% is much better. The other catalogs are much smaller;
> the only worrisome one is pg_dump because it's only 25% done, so you'd
> need to work a lot to get it yellow in the table.

Yes, in this case I saw the low-hanging fruit as getting the Italian
translation for Postgres over the 80% line. Anything else is a
nice-to-have.

--
Thom

I'm working hard in spare time to achive at least 80%!
I downloaded source files from https://babel.postgresql.org/ ... not to blame other people job but i found out a lot of garbage in those files.. 
my goal would be have at least 80% for every files before Sunday 9 October

Il giovedì 29 settembre 2022 17:31:19 CEST, Thom Brown <thom(at)linux(dot)com> ha scritto:

On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 16:29, Álvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> wrote:
>
> On 2022-Sep-29, Thom Brown wrote:
>
> > Domenico, will you be able to get the Italian translations completed
> > and submitted prior to that date?
>
> Note that "completed" means 80% of the total, minimum.  Taking the
> server message catalog ("postgres") as a reference, that's currently at
> 78% for Italian, so you only need to add about 114 extra translations to
> it so that it is included.  It is not a *huge* effort.  Of course,
> getting it to 100% is much better.  The other catalogs are much smaller;
> the only worrisome one is pg_dump because it's only 25% done, so you'd
> need to work a lot to get it yellow in the table.

Yes, in this case I saw the low-hanging fruit as getting the Italian
translation for Postgres over the 80% line.  Anything else is a
nice-to-have.

--
Thom

Hi, 
in attachment the files translated. 
All files are 100% traslated except the main file (postgres-it.po) which is 88% translated.
Maybe I could improve translation of this last file, which is the due date before commit?

thanks
Domenico

Il giovedì 29 settembre 2022 17:31:19 CEST, Thom Brown <thom(at)linux(dot)com> ha scritto:

On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 16:29, Álvaro Herrera <alvherre(at)alvh(dot)no-ip(dot)org> wrote:
>
> On 2022-Sep-29, Thom Brown wrote:
>
> > Domenico, will you be able to get the Italian translations completed
> > and submitted prior to that date?
>
> Note that "completed" means 80% of the total, minimum.  Taking the
> server message catalog ("postgres") as a reference, that's currently at
> 78% for Italian, so you only need to add about 114 extra translations to
> it so that it is included.  It is not a *huge* effort.  Of course,
> getting it to 100% is much better.  The other catalogs are much smaller;
> the only worrisome one is pg_dump because it's only 25% done, so you'd
> need to work a lot to get it yellow in the table.

Yes, in this case I saw the low-hanging fruit as getting the Italian
translation for Postgres over the 80% line.  Anything else is a
nice-to-have.

--
Thom

On 06.10.22 17:16, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> Hi,
> in attachment the files translated.
> All files are 100% traslated except the main file (postgres-it.po) which is 88% translated.
> Maybe I could improve translation of this last file, which is the due date before commit?

Thank you for this work. Could you please go through this one more time
and check that all the --help output is correctly aligned. Right now it
looks all over the place.

We can still add translations after the 15.0 release, so there is no
need to rush.

(Also, update the Project-Id-Version: header to include the new major
version.)

Ok,  I'll go through! 
I would suspect that the problem's of alignment should arise, sorry for that :-(
To be honest looking at the original label I cannot understand if rules are defined for that case..
could you give me some hints about that?

Thanks

Il venerdì 7 ottobre 2022 08:22:31 CEST, Peter Eisentraut <peter(dot)eisentraut(at)enterprisedb(dot)com> ha scritto:

On 06.10.22 17:16, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> Hi,
> in attachment the files translated.
> All files are 100% traslated except the main file (postgres-it.po) which is 88% translated.
> Maybe I could improve translation of this last file, which is the due date before commit?

Thank you for this work.  Could you please go through this one more time
and check that all the --help output is correctly aligned.  Right now it
looks all over the place.

We can still add translations after the 15.0 release, so there is no
need to rush.

(Also, update the Project-Id-Version: header to include the new major
version.)

On 2022-Oct-07, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:

> Ok,  I'll go through! 
> I would suspect that the problem's of alignment should arise, sorry for that :-(
> To be honest looking at the original label I cannot understand if rules are defined for that case..
> could you give me some hints about that?

There are no strict rules. Just run each of the programs with the
--help option, and make sure that the output looks reasonable.

Some translators stick to 80 characters per line (splitting the line if
too long), others let lines run long. Most keep the same alignment
column as in the original language, but this is not a requirement
either.

psql also has:
psql --help=variables
psql --help=commands
I'm not aware of others.

Spanish has quite a mess, I now realize :-(

--
Álvaro Herrera 48°01'N 7°57'E — https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/
"Las cosas son buenas o malas segun las hace nuestra opinión" (Lisias)

On 11.10.22 18:07, Álvaro Herrera wrote:
> There are no strict rules. Just run each of the programs with the
> --help option, and make sure that the output looks reasonable.
>
> Some translators stick to 80 characters per line (splitting the line if
> too long), others let lines run long. Most keep the same alignment
> column as in the original language, but this is not a requirement
> either.

> Spanish has quite a mess, I now realize :-(

I have for a long long time wanted to create some kind of API to produce
two-column aligned output automatically. Maybe someone wants to give it
a try.

Hi all,
here main PO file fully translated

Bye
Domenico

Il mercoledì 12 ottobre 2022 08:02:34 CEST, Peter Eisentraut <peter(dot)eisentraut(at)enterprisedb(dot)com> ha scritto:

On 11.10.22 18:07, Álvaro Herrera wrote:

> There are no strict rules.  Just run each of the programs with the
> --help option, and make sure that the output looks reasonable.
>
> Some translators stick to 80 characters per line (splitting the line if
> too long), others let lines run long.  Most keep the same alignment
> column as in the original language, but this is not a requirement
> either.

> Spanish has quite a mess, I now realize :-(

I have for a long long time wanted to create some kind of API to produce
two-column aligned output automatically.  Maybe someone wants to give it
a try.

On Sun, 30 Oct 2022, 17:55 Domenico Sgarbossa, <sbraaaa(at)yahoo(dot)it> wrote:

Hi all,
here main PO file fully translated

Thanks for completing all those translations!

Thom

On 30.10.22 13:54, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:
> here main PO file fully translated

committed

On 2022-Oct-06, Domenico Sgarbossa wrote:

> Hi, 
> in attachment the files translated. 
> All files are 100% traslated except the main file (postgres-it.po) which is 88% translated.
> Maybe I could improve translation of this last file, which is the due date before commit?

I have committed these other files now, but please do have a look at the
alignment of the --help output.

--
Álvaro Herrera Breisgau, Deutschland — https://www.EnterpriseDB.com/